Ok, dude, that's cool. I'm not going to sit here and judge other people's situation, I'm merely commenting on the absurd nature of the argument. Truth be told, I think most people have "pirated" something or other in their lifetimes, so I'd be a hypocrite if I didn't admit to having done the same (at some point). That being said, I'm gonna go and drink another round of vodka sours. Sure it's gonna cost me some money up front, I only get a few measly hours of enjoyment, and I might wake up with a hangover... but in my mind, it's still worth it
of course you do. Developers aren't confused. We fully understand that your skewed morals make it acceptable for you to take what you want without regard to others or the law. We get it, taking stuff without paying is OK with you and all the others like you. This isn't news to us.
But our opinion is exactly what you asked for. As Strawdog pointed it out above I think we are less confused about your motives than you are. Most of us probably dont think it is worth our time to try to stop iPhone App piracy, especially because we also realize that it is out of our control anyway. And guess what, we live with it. Its Mr. Sir Buffoon to you. The analogy is your attempt to put a noble spin on theft. Good for you. If you think we have it so easy why not build a killer game and give it away for free on the AppStore? That will teach us not to be the greedy pigs we are. This being said I can drive a nail through a wooden plank. Does that make me a good carpenter? Sorry if I hurt your feelings but youre the one stealing and bragging about it.
I skipped to the last page because I didn't feel like reading everything. I'm no developer(though I want to be one really really bad) but, even if I knew how, I would never Pirate a game. No matter what way you put it, "try before you buy" or whatever, it's still theft and it's still wrong. Bye.
To, i think it was Crimson a few pages back, whoever said something about not wanting to waste money in the recession... I was appalled. That is the kind of selfish thoughts that make me hate pirates who try and defend themselves. Do you not think that the devs are struggling as well? Also to Dorino and Crimson and any other "I pay if I like it" do you feel morally superior to someone who goes to their local game store and slips Pokemon or GTA or any game under their shirt and leaves?
I have no idea what you mean to imply there. Good for you. Not the point, but good observation! I didn't ask for a thing, though I encouraged discussion. Good for you! I respect that, good job being a great developer. This thread was primarily directed at developers who were under the impression it was worth their time to pioneer against pirates. My mistake, sorry. How is the analogy any attempt of mine? You're the one who used it, not me. Missing the point D: When did I brag in the course of this 9 page thread? Never.
Wow. I really don't have time to converse on this today, but a quick review of your posts suggest you have been bragging the whole time. Considering who your desired audience is, all of these statements are bragging: "I've often pirated apps..." [I address devs, and tell them I steal, and do it a lot] "...most of those, at one time or another, were freshly downloaded off of ********** So were atleast 3 pages more of apps, that I deleted, not feeling worth my money." [I address devs, and tell them I steal, and many of them I delete without ever paying for them] "The try-b4-guy is me. He downloads a cracked app to see if he likes it, and if the developer had earned his money." [I address devs, and tell them I steal, but I steal in a good way. Honest, I really do!] "If you hate it, the dev does not deserve anything. I'm not going to pay for a pile of crap no matter how much time a developer put into it, that's not what I care about." [I address devs, and tell them I steal, and I only care about myself, and have no respect for devs] "Respecting the effort is something I agree people should try to do, but I can't respect effort when respect isn't due. I don't respect their rules if I don't know it's worth my time. I delete apps that suck." [I address devs, and tell them I steal, and I'll respect them if I feel like it, but really, only if they're making me happy. If they're not, well hey, stealing is neato.] "I can't justify giving my money to a person just because he spent time on something. It needs to be good and I personally want to find that out." [I address devs, and tell them I steal, and making a $2 mistake is just too much for me.] "I feel justified. I've done nothing myself to make any indie developer suffer. I support them to the best of my ability, whether I, at one point, had a cracked copy of their app/game or not!" [I address devs, and tell them I steal, but make it seem like I'm a good guy, cuz I try real hard to help, when I feel like it.] "That aside, most pirates are assholes. I can't justify everyone's actions, but I can justify mine." [I address devs, and tell them I steal, but I'm much better than those other stealers.] "Experiences come with value, but as a consumer on the internet it's ultimately my choice whether that value is reasonable. Like it or not." [I address devs, and tell them I steal, and it's because it's the Internet, and the Internet makes it okay for me to steal, cuz I won't get caught. Don't like it? Tough.] "Shutting up isn't something I'm going to do when people say pirates like me dont exist or should be treated the same as all others. I deserve the developers respect the same as he would any other customer, plain and simple." [I address devs, and tell them I steal. Then I demand their respect, because I stole their game, and a small percentage of the time, I decided to buy it later.] "I feel my actions are morally justified" [I address devs, and tell them I steal because it's the right thing to do] "I'm demoing applications before I purchase them." [I address devs, and tell them I steal, but I'm only paying for a percentage of them after the fact. The rest are SOL.]
Okay, I never INTENDED to brag. Your paraphrasing is total shit though. That just makes me feel bad. I think I'll go steal to make the pain go away
Ok I don't pirate but I see both sides, even though I think im going towards to developer side. The Pirates side: So a new chocolate bar line comes out, people taste and it's awful. They ask for a refund and they get it. But they can yell that the games bad after they buy an itunes game, they can't get a refund. Those 2 things are about the same price. But developers, that may be their only product at the moment. Their trying to make a living, they tried their best. You pay for the experience. It's like taking a ride on a rollar coaster. IT's for the experience, some may not be good, but you still paid, took the chance, and helped the park keep the rides up and running.
I wasn't implying anything, i was asking a question, which you did not answer, so again: do you feel morally superior to someone who goes to their local game store and slips Pokemon or GTA or any game under their shirt and leaves?
Nope, it's exactly how I, as a developer, read your original comments. That's how they made me feel, and probably how it made a lot of us feel. It's like walking into a police station, telling all the cops that you routinely take joyrides in cop cars, and that you return most of them if you feel like it. But hey, it was after hours, so they weren't being used, and nobody got hurt. What's the big deal! You decided to address developers, who participate in a market you routinely steal from, in a developer forum of all places. You were expecting us to say thank you for stealing from many of us, and, when you feel like it, paying a few of us? Your original premise was that we should be thinking about you during the development process, since you're our customer too. Hate to break it to you, but you're not. Then you felt you deserved our respect, just like any other customer. Not going to happen. Ever. If you steal, you get no respect. Buying a game after you stole it doesn't change the fact that you stole it.
That's what I don't understand. I still buy the game, but by some logic I'm wronging you if I'd downloaded it before hand? What harm is done? I'm quite confused. And I can see where your coming from when I take that all as an opinion, but I didn't when I replied. It seemed like you were just bashing me D: On that note, your respect was never something I wanted to gain... If you don't respect me, I don't really care. Respect my efforts and any work I might do the same as I respect yours, and ****ing agree to disagree amirite EDIT: And by my definition, all pirates are your consumers. They utilize your work and you shouldn't neccasarily cater them but attempting to hinder them is a giant waste of time... In my opinion.
I do, but I feel the same superiority shamelessly over pirates you steal a game and do nothing else. I feel worth more since I would sneak the game back in if it's a POS Not that I'd ever buy a video game locally. Steam is where it is at, man.
When you try games for free, they all have equal value to you, zero. That is not their price, yet that is the price you've decided to pay. No matter how you slice it, that are stealing. I do not understand how you think paying for some of them later makes anything better. You stole all of them. The fact that you bought some of them later is completely irrelevant. Not to you obviously, but most definitely to us.
So the fact is is theft is the turn off? You refuse to accept thieves as customers even when they do it right? Listen, if lite games weren't usually horrible and game play videos were played by people with an understanding of the game I wouldn't resort to what I sometimes do. But alas. It is stealing, but I feel it makes it better when I reimburse the dev for their great work. I see where you're coming from, I guess. I'll respect your work, you respect mine, and we can hate eachother's guts as much as we please, yes?
Let me help you out then: Writing code = using a hammer Developing a worthwhile piece of software = being a good carpenter
Alright I just felt the need to sign up and say one thing. LWBS, I have the utmost respect for you and your work, and I own both of your games legally because the light versions are - well, perfect. But this is not the case for every game. Let's use "APP X" as the app I have just downloaded (a pirated copy). It costs $9.99. It was developed by "DEVELOPER X". Putting morals aside (I don't want to get into the whole what is stealing and what isn't argument), my downloading of the pirated version of "APP X" in NO WAY affected the developer's income. Now, if I downloaded a cracked version OPPOSED to a legal version, that is something else. But that it is a rarity in the world of pirating software. Most pirates have NO INTENTION of buying the game. That is the VAST majority of pirates for any type of software, be it an X-Box game or an iPhone app. Then come the other two types of pirates, which in my opinion, seem to cancel each other out (For the most part). One pirate would like to try your app before buying it. They are very careful with their money, and don't want to waste any of it on something they won't enjoy. Very similar to a trip to an ice cream shop, and trying a small spoonful of ice cream before actually ordering the cone. If you like the flavor, you order it. If not, you move on and try another. The last pirate is the one that would buy your app if they had to, but since they have a way of obtaining it for free, they will. This is the only pirate that ACTUALLY HINDERS a developer's income. So my point is: Comparing the pirating of App Store applications to stealing in real world scenarios is both trivial and frivolous (Yea, i know a little hypocritical because of my analogy above, but its all i could think of). In real life, if you steal an X-Box 360 game, the game disc, box, etc etc have ACTUAL WORTH. In terms of software, APP X has absolutely ZERO value. It is nothing more than some server costs for whatever site you downloaded it from. The developer has lost NOTHING, unless this cracked version was downloaded instead of a legitimate copy (Which, as i explained above, is a rarity). So please, LWBS, and other developers alike. Let's not waste time trying to contain the pirates, because as crimson and dorino have said, they will ALWAYS find a way. nothing is totally bulletproof. Let's also not waste time trying to change each other's morals and beliefs. Let me ask you (you being any developer in this discussion): Morals and stealing aside, why exactly do you hate pirates?
